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Stevo
03-Oct-2016, 21:52
So there's been discussions going on here for quite a while now about
whether we should move our file & email services to the 'cloud'. If we
were to go this way, it would be with micro$oft <SHUDDER> office 365 e3
(I believe) scenario.

My boss seems to think it will solve any storage issues we have
permanently, which several of us have told him that's probably not the
case, at least down the road.

It's been brought up here that having user data in the cloud would
benefit people here that are more mobile, and I agree it probably
would. The kicker is, out of over 750 employees, we have very few that
would realistically need there data this way, and IMO moving everyone
to the cloud for these few is a HUGE amount of work and expense, *plus*
having almost everyone here encountering a large learning curve on how
things would be done.

Wondering if any of you are doing this, or no people who are, and could
give me some real world insights, pros, cons, etc.

--
Stevo

Susan
04-Oct-2016, 01:09
Stevo:

Microfocus has created a new discussion group named Microfocus
Support Technical Discussions that's available to ask such questions
to perhaps a wider audience, though it's just been created so the
audience might not be so wide quite yet.

That said, you are welcome to continue to ask such questions here,
among your friends. :)

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ketter
04-Oct-2016, 13:47
On Mon, 03 Oct 2016 20:52:37 GMT, "Stevo" <steveSPAM@LESSccgov.net>
wrote:

>So there's been discussions going on here for quite a while now about
>whether we should move our file & email services to the 'cloud'. If we
>were to go this way, it would be with micro$oft <SHUDDER> office 365 e3
>(I believe) scenario.
>
>My boss seems to think it will solve any storage issues we have
>permanently, which several of us have told him that's probably not the
>case, at least down the road.
>
>It's been brought up here that having user data in the cloud would
>benefit people here that are more mobile, and I agree it probably
>would. The kicker is, out of over 750 employees, we have very few that
>would realistically need there data this way, and IMO moving everyone
>to the cloud for these few is a HUGE amount of work and expense, *plus*
>having almost everyone here encountering a large learning curve on how
>things would be done.
>
>Wondering if any of you are doing this, or no people who are, and could
>give me some real world insights, pros, cons, etc.

Hey Stevo. We haven't gone that route. But just a thought, have you
looked at Filr for the users who need remote access? We are using
that here.
Ken

--------------------------------------------------------
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Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 14:41
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> Microfocus has created a new discussion group named Microfocus
> Support Technical Discussions that's available to ask such questions
> to perhaps a wider audience, though it's just been created so the
> audience might not be so wide quite yet.
>
> That said, you are welcome to continue to ask such questions here,
> among your friends. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Thanks for the info.

--
Stevo

Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 14:43
KeN Etter sounds like they 'said':

> Hey Stevo. We haven't gone that route. But just a thought, have you
> looked at Filr for the users who need remote access? We are using
> that here.
> Ken
>

So my response to KeN's comment is...

Well that would involve purchasing edir licensing which is out. Also,
how would that work as far as sharing files with people outside of our
organization?

One 'perk' of the cloud route being passed around is the ability for
users to share files/folders with pretty much anyone.

--
Stevo

malcolmlewis
04-Oct-2016, 14:49
On Mon 03 Oct 2016 08:52:37 PM CDT, Stevo wrote:

So there's been discussions going on here for quite a while now about
whether we should move our file & email services to the 'cloud'. If we
were to go this way, it would be with micro$oft <SHUDDER> office 365 e3
(I believe) scenario.

My boss seems to think it will solve any storage issues we have
permanently, which several of us have told him that's probably not the
case, at least down the road.

It's been brought up here that having user data in the cloud would
benefit people here that are more mobile, and I agree it probably
would. The kicker is, out of over 750 employees, we have very few that
would realistically need there data this way, and IMO moving everyone
to the cloud for these few is a HUGE amount of work and expense, *plus*
having almost everyone here encountering a large learning curve on how
things would be done.

Wondering if any of you are doing this, or no people who are, and could
give me some real world insights, pros, cons, etc.



Hi
What about Owncloud...
https://owncloud.org/

--
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ab
04-Oct-2016, 15:26
One of Filr's features is sharing files both internally and externally, as
I recall:

https://www.novell.com/products/filr/features/help-you-take-back-control.html

A client of mine recently sent me a link to access stuff via Filr; seemed
to work just fine.


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Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 16:10
ab sounds like they 'said':

> One of Filr's features is sharing files both internally and
> externally, as I recall:
>
>
https://www.novell.com/products/filr/features/help-you-take-back-control.html
>
> A client of mine recently sent me a link to access stuff via Filr;
> seemed to work just fine.

So my response to ab's comment is...

Good to know, too bad we probably won't be going back to edir, will be
surprised if we're still on Groupwise in the next 3-6 months. :-(

--
Stevo

Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 16:11
malcolmlewis sounds like they 'said':

> Hi
> What about Owncloud...
> https://owncloud.org/

So my response to malcolmlewis's comment is...

The big push for us is m$ licensing (windows, office, etc) and going to
their cloud package will 'solve all our problems' according to m$.

--
Stevo

Susan
04-Oct-2016, 16:17
Stevo:

You're welcome. I've just come to my senses and realized that the new
Business Solutions discussion forum would probably be the better
choice, if you wanted to try the new forums, for the question you
asked.

And, fine to have asked it here. :)

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ab
04-Oct-2016, 16:23
Maybe I'm thick, but I do not think Filr even depends on eDirectory for
its user store, but can use any old LDAP directory. I'm open to being
corrected, but I think that's the case.

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Susan
04-Oct-2016, 16:39
You're not thick. It works with Active Directory, NetIQ eDirectory or
a combination of both. :)

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ketter
04-Oct-2016, 16:43
On Tue, 04 Oct 2016 13:43:22 GMT, "Stevo" <steveSPAM@LESSccgov.net>
wrote:

>KeN Etter sounds like they 'said':
>
>> Hey Stevo. We haven't gone that route. But just a thought, have you
>> looked at Filr for the users who need remote access? We are using
>> that here.
>> Ken
>>
>
>So my response to KeN's comment is...
>
>Well that would involve purchasing edir licensing which is out. Also,
>how would that work as far as sharing files with people outside of our
>organization?
>
>One 'perk' of the cloud route being passed around is the ability for
>users to share files/folders with pretty much anyone.

Nope. eDirectory not required. And yes, you can share files with
other people outside your org. You really should check it out.
Ken

--------------------------------------------------------
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https://www.novell.com/products/enhancement-request.html

Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 16:46
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> You're not thick. It works with Active Directory, NetIQ eDirectory or
> a combination of both. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

But it requires purchasing licensing. We are in a budget crunch so
that won't be happening.

--
Stevo

malcolmlewis
04-Oct-2016, 17:03
On Tue 04 Oct 2016 03:11:48 PM CDT, Stevo wrote:

The big push for us is m$ licensing (windows, office, etc) and going to
their cloud package will 'solve all our problems' according to m$.

Hi
<checks calendar>Nope not April 1st</checks calendar> ;)

So how much storage do you use (if it's ok to ask?)....

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Susan
04-Oct-2016, 17:24
Well, it doesn't hurt to check the product page to see what the full
requirements are. I just know those two. :)

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Susan
04-Oct-2016, 17:31
Also, wouldn't there be licensing for the Microsoft Cloud solution?

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Susan
04-Oct-2016, 17:33
https://www.novell.com/products/filr/technicalinfo/

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Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 17:40
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Also, wouldn't there be licensing for the Microsoft Cloud solution?

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Yes there would be licensing for that direction. Budget was submitted
to go one way or the other, all or nothing, and not sure if the number
would cover staying with what we have and including filr or not.

I emailed our contact at cdw to see about a quote, just to see what it
runs per license.

It's a complicated situation here, moving to m$'s ecs licensing would
probably make things easier licensing-wise, and they're trying to sell
my boss saying it will be cheaper in the long run, but I don't believe
that's the case.

--
Stevo

Susan
04-Oct-2016, 17:45
If you don't believe it's the case, then do a spreadsheet of actual
figures, but don't be surprised if they ignore it, anyway. Once MS
gets a grip on a decision maker, they don't let go. They have other
ways of persuading decision makers to choose MS.

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Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 17:49
malcolmlewis sounds like they 'said':

> <checks calendar>Nope not April 1st</checks calendar> ;)

Right, I haven't received any bd wishes, so that must be the case. ;-)


> So how much storage do you use (if it's ok to ask?)....

Current amount of space allocated for file & email storage.

File (including OS, apps storage, roaming profiles, etc): ~4,009 GB

Email (including OS): ~883 GB

These are VMs on different hosts at different locations and obviously
have free space on their respective file / email volumes.


--
Stevo

Stevo
04-Oct-2016, 17:51
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> If you don't believe it's the case, then do a spreadsheet of actual
> figures, but don't be surprised if they ignore it, anyway. Once MS
> gets a grip on a decision maker, they don't let go. They have other
> ways of persuading decision makers to choose MS.

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Oh believe me, I understand that. We were somewhat promised the
cheaper way to go a few years ago was to ditch edir (aside from what we
get with our GW licensing) and go with a.d. Did that and it seems
every time we turn around there's some additional fee, licensing, or
maintenance we need to start paying.

--
Stevo

Susan
05-Oct-2016, 00:02
Stevo:

Then that might be a good report to give them. Their initial promised
costs before the changes, and what it's now become after, showing the
additional charges that have been tacked on since the onset of the
changes.

That would be a pretty strong argument against believing MS, if
nothing else, but certainly regarding projected "savings" and costs.

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Stevo
01-Nov-2016, 23:14
Well, I've been informed. We're going to migrate to the cloud. I
still voiced my displeasure, and asked if, down the road a few years,
m$ cranks the pricing way up after I could laugh in everyone's faces.


--
Stevo

Susan
02-Nov-2016, 15:03
Stevo:

I'm so sorry for you, but I confess I'm not surprised. You might not
have to wait for a raise in the prices to say "I told you so",
though. There are other things, besides hikes in prices, that can
happen that could have a negative impact on them. One hopes, for
their sake and yours, that doesn't happen, but it's possible. :)

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Stevo
02-Nov-2016, 15:24
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> I'm so sorry for you, but I confess I'm not surprised. You might not
> have to wait for a raise in the prices to say "I told you so",
> though. There are other things, besides hikes in prices, that can
> happen that could have a negative impact on them. One hopes, for
> their sake and yours, that doesn't happen, but it's possible. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

I am definitely not looking forward to it. I don't like the loss of
control for one.

I might be the one that, when a user calls saying they can't get to
something in their files or email, just gives them the number to call
micro$oft. That or the first time email doesn't go to/from some domain
or something, I will just laugh and laugh.

--
Stevo

Susan
02-Nov-2016, 17:12
Stevo:

I can already see the day, and imagine the post from you in here. :)

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Stevo
02-Nov-2016, 17:24
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> I can already see the day, and imagine the post from you in here. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

;-)

--
Stevo

kgroneman
02-Nov-2016, 17:38
Just don't come running to you when one day the "cloud" is down and
nothing is working that day, right?

--
Kim - 11/2/2016 10:38:23 AM

Stevo
02-Nov-2016, 17:45
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> I can already see the day, and imagine the post from you in here. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Quick question, we are supposedly going to stagger the migration, but
I'm wondering what will happen with our Groupwise licenses? The
maintenance expires Dec 31. I'm wondering if we don't renew
maintenance for the next year, will we still be able to use Groupwise
or not?

--
Stevo

Stevo
02-Nov-2016, 17:45
kgroneman sounds like they 'said':

> Just don't come running to you when one day the "cloud" is down and
> nothing is working that day, right?

So my response to kgroneman's comment is...

EGGG........ZACTLY. <G>

--
Stevo

Susan
02-Nov-2016, 23:14
Stevo:

I've no idea, but let me see if I can find an answer for you, or a
better place for you to ask than where someone has no idea!

The new microfocus.support.technical-discussions might be a good
place to post such a question. People with either the answer, or who
know where to find it, are probably monitoring that group. :)

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Stevo
02-Nov-2016, 23:35
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> I've no idea, but let me see if I can find an answer for you, or a
> better place for you to ask than where someone has no idea!
>
> The new microfocus.support.technical-discussions might be a good
> place to post such a question. People with either the answer, or who
> know where to find it, are probably monitoring that group. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Ok, I just figured with your Goddess status, you would know. :-D

--
Stevo

Susan
03-Nov-2016, 00:59
Stevo:

When it comes to licensing issues, I try to refrain from involvement
because they're always sort of a nightmare maze of more words than
necessary, and less clarity than appropriate. This is one of those
issues where wisdom dictates staying out of that mess. :)

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Stevo
03-Nov-2016, 14:46
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Stevo:
>
> When it comes to licensing issues, I try to refrain from involvement
> because they're always sort of a nightmare maze of more words than
> necessary, and less clarity than appropriate. This is one of those
> issues where wisdom dictates staying out of that mess. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Gotcha. #GoCubsGo

--
Stevo

kgroneman
03-Nov-2016, 16:25
I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
system/company to host critical systems.

--
Kim - 11/3/2016 9:24:47 AM

hendersj
03-Nov-2016, 16:57
On Thu, 03 Nov 2016 15:25:23 +0000, kgroneman wrote:

> I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> system/company to host critical systems.

It's a cost question, ultimately. No different than, say, buying a
popular operating system and having a week-long outage because of a
defect. It's in your data center, but you're still dependent on the
vendor for a fix, and if the incident isn't being handled effectively,
you're still down.

BTDTGTTS.

Ultimately, it comes down to how the cloud provider deals with redundancy
- but if they've done it right, you can achieve the same kinds of uptime
that you would with on-premises solutions.

(For those who don't know, I work for a company that provides both SaaS
and on-prem solutions)

--
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Novell/SUSE/NetIQ Knowledge Partner

Stevo
03-Nov-2016, 17:30
kgroneman sounds like they 'said':

> I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> system/company to host critical systems.

So my response to kgroneman's comment is...

Oh believe me, I'm on the same page, especially when it's m$ <shudder>.

Ironic thing is, I mentioned a project we're working on (updating 2012
servers to 2012r2, pretty much our file servers left), saying we will
be able to skip these as they will be going away, boss said he doesn't
see us ever getting rid of our file servers.

WTH is the point of keeping these servers when our data will be in the
'cloud'?

--
Stevo

malcolmlewis
03-Nov-2016, 18:03
On Thu 03 Nov 2016 03:57:03 PM CDT, Jim Henderson wrote:

On Thu, 03 Nov 2016 15:25:23 +0000, kgroneman wrote:

> I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> system/company to host critical systems.

It's a cost question, ultimately. No different than, say, buying a
popular operating system and having a week-long outage because of a
defect. It's in your data center, but you're still dependent on the
vendor for a fix, and if the incident isn't being handled effectively,
you're still down.

BTDTGTTS.

Ultimately, it comes down to how the cloud provider deals with
redundancy
- but if they've done it right, you can achieve the same kinds of
uptime that you would with on-premises solutions.

(For those who don't know, I work for a company that provides both SaaS
and on-prem solutions)



Hi
It's also (hopefully) identifying potential points of failure along the
way at least with an inhouse solution (assuming in the same locale) you
have a bit more control.

Then there is bandwidth requirements for all the incoming and outgoing
data.... what about diversity if something outside is affected. At
least inhouse can still access data, may not be able to to facebook or
send emails....but can still carry on normal operations?

Point in case a educational institution here decided to implement
students BYOH, all should be good, wound up having to upgrade their
network internal (wireless and ethernet) and external to carry the
extra 'cloud' load... $$$

And don't get me started on privacy information loss (and our son is on
this list, through a third party which we had no control over.)

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hendersj
03-Nov-2016, 20:00
On Thu, 03 Nov 2016 17:03:16 +0000, malcolmlewis wrote:

> Hi It's also (hopefully) identifying potential points of failure along
> the way at least with an inhouse solution (assuming in the same locale)
> you have a bit more control.
>
> Then there is bandwidth requirements for all the incoming and outgoing
> data.... what about diversity if something outside is affected. At least
> inhouse can still access data, may not be able to to facebook or send
> emails....but can still carry on normal operations?
>
> Point in case a educational institution here decided to implement
> students BYOH, all should be good, wound up having to upgrade their
> network internal (wireless and ethernet) and external to carry the extra
> 'cloud' load... $$$
>
> And don't get me started on privacy information loss (and our son is on
> this list, through a third party which we had no control over.)

Yep, all of which comes down to the cost equation.

We've seen plenty of examples where data that was housed "internally" was
compromised as well - look at things like the Target breach for examples
of how "in-house" solutions still aren't a guarantee of control or
security of PII.

Jim

--
Jim Henderson, CNA6, CDE, CNI, LPIC-1, CLA10, CLP10
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kgroneman
03-Nov-2016, 21:02
Hey Stevo:

>WTH is the point of keeping these servers when our data will be in the
>'cloud'?

Backup? :-) Boy..isn't that a 180 degree turn around from the past.

--
Kim - 11/3/2016 2:02:22 PM

Stevo
03-Nov-2016, 21:28
kgroneman sounds like they 'said':

> Backup? :-) Boy..isn't that a 180 degree turn around from the past.

So my response to kgroneman's comment is...

Well we were told the data will be stored in redundant locations
(meaning multiple copies), and that (IIRC) we'd be able to point our
backup servers at the data to actually back it up.

--
Stevo

Susan
04-Nov-2016, 15:56
Stevo:

But, if the worst happens, and the cloud is down, will you be able to
do anything with the backed up data to be able to continue
functioning? :)

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Stevo
05-Nov-2016, 18:38
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> But, if the worst happens, and the cloud is down, will you be able to
> do anything with the backed up data to be able to continue
> functioning? :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

I get that, but one of the reasons it was decided to go this way was to
free up a bunch of storage space locally, and having a copy of the data
locally will not do that.

--
Stevo

Susan
05-Nov-2016, 20:20
OMG, you have the pointy haired boss! :)

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Susan
05-Nov-2016, 20:27
Stevo:

I got an answer, not from someone who works for Micro Focus, so,
though this is an answer from a very knowledgeable person, it should
not be construed as an "official" answer:

"It depends what licenses they have now. "They may have a
subscription, in which case they won't be allowed to keep using it.
Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won't
get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count."

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Stevo
07-Nov-2016, 15:44
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> "It depends what licenses they have now. "They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won't be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won't
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count."

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Ok, I'm guessing we bought them, as we've had licenses since the GW4.1
days, although didn't get to our current count until GW5.5 I think.

--
Stevo

Stevo
07-Nov-2016, 15:55
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> "It depends what licenses they have now. "They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won't be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won't
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count."

So my response to Susan's comment is...

I'm also guessing that if GMS is not allowed, the same thing would
apply to Messenger.

--
Stevo

Stevo
07-Nov-2016, 19:02
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> "It depends what licenses they have now. "They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won't be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won't
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count."

So my response to Susan's comment is...

I mentioned this to the people in our office spearheading this project
this morning. Caught them off guard a bit, and they found our license
agreement, and this is the case, so there would be no more GMS or
Messenger. They also realized that we would no longer have access to
SLES (our web server doing reverse proxy stuff) and would have to find
some other way to get this done.

<shhhhh>, kinda made me giggle.

--
Stevo

kgroneman
07-Nov-2016, 21:55
Just stay on GW. Easier for everyone. :-)

--
Kim - 11/7/2016 1:54:48 PM

Stevo
07-Nov-2016, 22:11
kgroneman sounds like they 'said':

> Just stay on GW. Easier for everyone. :-)

So my response to kgroneman's comment is...

Oh believe me, I *WANT* to, but it's not up to me. :-(

--
Stevo

Susan
08-Nov-2016, 03:37
LOL The amusing times have already begun. :)

--
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Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator

Please read the following before posting in here:
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> <shhhhh>, kinda made me giggle.

Stevo
08-Nov-2016, 15:41
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> LOL The amusing times have already begun. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

Oh, and then it was found out m$ has not informed them of some things
beforehand, even after dozens of meetings. Something about data upload
limits with sharepoint online, other sharepoint fees, etc etc.

So begins the fleecing methinks.

--
Stevo

Susan
09-Nov-2016, 02:04
Things are getting interesting! I'll bet you smile at everything you
hear like this. :)

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Stevo
09-Nov-2016, 15:40
Susan sounds like they 'said':

> Things are getting interesting! I'll bet you smile at everything you
> hear like this. :)

So my response to Susan's comment is...

I most certainly do. <VBG>

--
Stevo

AndersG
22-Dec-2016, 15:17
Kgroneman,
> I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> system/company to host critical systems

Was it not Douglas Adams that wrote about SEP-Fields (Someone Else's
Problem)

--
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The Aaland Islands (N60 E20)

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hendersj
22-Dec-2016, 18:12
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:17:15 +0000, Anders Gustafsson wrote:

> Kgroneman,
>> I'm always a little amazed at how people trust some external
>> system/company to host critical systems
>
> Was it not Douglas Adams that wrote about SEP-Fields (Someone Else's
> Problem)

It was indeed. ("Somebody Else's Problem", but close enough. ;) )

Jim



--
Jim Henderson, CNA6, CDE, CNI, LPIC-1, CLA10, CLP10
Novell/SUSE/NetIQ Knowledge Partner

kjhurni
22-Dec-2016, 20:06
stevo;2445397 Wrote:
> Susan sounds like they 'said':
>
> > Also, wouldn't there be licensing for the Microsoft Cloud solution?
>
> So my response to Susan's comment is...
>
> Yes there would be licensing for that direction. Budget was submitted
> to go one way or the other, all or nothing, and not sure if the number
> would cover staying with what we have and including filr or not.
>
> I emailed our contact at cdw to see about a quote, just to see what it
> runs per license.
>
> It's a complicated situation here, moving to m$'s ecs licensing would
> probably make things easier licensing-wise, and they're trying to sell
> my boss saying it will be cheaper in the long run, but I don't believe
> that's the case.
>
> --
> Stevo

Well, be very careful of what MS claims. MS claimed it would save us
millions and it turned out to be the other way around.

O365 (at the G3 level) is licensed per mailbox per month. Our GroupWise
(60k/year) went to 1.2 million for O365. How's that for a "cost
savings".

We *used* to be able to buy Office for $289 for 3 years under the old
licensing model and that was on a per machine license. Another area had
6,000 machines, but 40k, users.

Well when we were forced to "save money" to O365, the other area now has
to pay for 40,000 licenses per month at somewhere around $12/user/month.
So $144/user/year. No cost savings there.

Oh, and the WAN upgrades needed to support the cloud? Yeah, our monthly
bill is about 10x what it used to be.

Oh, and you have to use the nasty MS "on demand" Office install which
means you cannot configure it, you run it and it installs EVERYTHING.
Whether you want/need it or not. And you also get the joy of being
force-upgraded/patched without ANY notification by MS. We're constantly
having Outlook problems because MS is essentially using the entire o365
stack as beta testers, except you pay for it. For months we had people
not able to access Shared folders, etc.

Now, maybe in a SMALL environment, it would make sense. For a large
place, I say avoid it like the plague.

Oh, and OneDrive is nowhere near as nice/flexible as Filr or practically
anything else. OneDrive requires you to have pre-knowledge about what
you need "offsite", and/or relocate ALL your data in the cloud. Good
luck dealing with access issues/rights/data security in that
envirioment.

Oh, it's also problem prone for anything pretty much over 30,000 files
(not unusual for us) or "large" amounts of data. Again, may work in a
smaller environment.

But that's just me. I'm sure O365 works well for some people without
many problems at all, but I seriously question the methodology that MS
uses to claim a "cost savings". Seriously do you think that MS would
want everyone over to model that "saves money" (ie, makes them LESS
money)? They don't like people buying a copy of Office and keeping it
for 5+ years. They want a guaranteed stream of revenue (even Office
personal after the first "intro" year is like $100/year or something).


--
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Stevo
22-Dec-2016, 23:59
kjhurni sounds like they 'said':

>
> Well, be very careful of what MS claims. MS claimed it would save us
> millions and it turned out to be the other way around.
>
> O365 (at the G3 level) is licensed per mailbox per month. Our
> GroupWise (60k/year) went to 1.2 million for O365. How's that for a
> "cost savings".
>
> We used to be able to buy Office for $289 for 3 years under the old
> licensing model and that was on a per machine license. Another area
> had 6,000 machines, but 40k, users.
>
> Well when we were forced to "save money" to O365, the other area now
> has to pay for 40,000 licenses per month at somewhere around
> $12/user/month. So $144/user/year. No cost savings there.
>
> Oh, and the WAN upgrades needed to support the cloud? Yeah, our
> monthly bill is about 10x what it used to be.
>
> Oh, and you have to use the nasty MS "on demand" Office install which
> means you cannot configure it, you run it and it installs EVERYTHING.
> Whether you want/need it or not. And you also get the joy of being
> force-upgraded/patched without ANY notification by MS. We're
> constantly having Outlook problems because MS is essentially using
> the entire o365 stack as beta testers, except you pay for it. For
> months we had people not able to access Shared folders, etc.
>
> Now, maybe in a SMALL environment, it would make sense. For a large
> place, I say avoid it like the plague.
>
> Oh, and OneDrive is nowhere near as nice/flexible as Filr or
> practically anything else. OneDrive requires you to have
> pre-knowledge about what you need "offsite", and/or relocate ALL your
> data in the cloud. Good luck dealing with access issues/rights/data
> security in that envirioment.
>
> Oh, it's also problem prone for anything pretty much over 30,000 files
> (not unusual for us) or "large" amounts of data. Again, may work in a
> smaller environment.
>
> But that's just me. I'm sure O365 works well for some people without
> many problems at all, but I seriously question the methodology that MS
> uses to claim a "cost savings". Seriously do you think that MS would
> want everyone over to model that "saves money" (ie, makes them LESS
> money)? They don't like people buying a copy of Office and keeping it
> for 5+ years. They want a guaranteed stream of revenue (even Office
> personal after the first "intro" year is like $100/year or something).

So my response to kjhurni's comment is...

Oh we've already been privvy to what M$ "claims". They said nothing
about data caps, upload caps, stuff like that in any of the 20-100
meetings our people had discussing this.

I'm afraid many of the things you mentioned will rear their ugly heads
for us, but I've decided I'm just going to sit back and laugh whenever
things go haywire, as I was staunchly opposed to this decision from day
one.

Plus, we have been directed to cut our budgets (our big one is
operating, right where this whole thing will fall) and I have a feeling
our budget will do nothing but climb now.

--
Stevo