# Cloud question
**URL:** https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725
**Category:** Chatting over the Back Fence
**Created:** [October 3, 2016, 11:52pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725 "2016-10-03T23:52:37Z")
**Posts on this page:** 19
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@kgroneman](https://forums.suse.com/u/kgroneman)
#### Post date: [November 3, 2016, 10:02pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/41 "2016-11-03T22:02:44Z")
Hey Stevo:
[color=blue]
> WTH is the point of keeping these servers when our data will be in the
> ‘cloud’?[/color]
Backup? 🙂 Boy…isn’t that a 180 degree turn around from the past.
–
Kim - 11/3/2016 2:02:22 PM
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 3, 2016, 10:28pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/42 "2016-11-03T22:28:23Z")
kgroneman sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> Backup? 🙂 Boy…isn’t that a 180 degree turn around from the past.[/color]
So my response to kgroneman’s comment is…
Well we were told the data will be stored in redundant locations
(meaning multiple copies), and that (IIRC) we’d be able to point our
backup servers at the data to actually back it up.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 4, 2016, 4:56pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/43 "2016-11-04T16:56:46Z")
Stevo:
But, if the worst happens, and the cloud is down, will you be able to
do anything with the backed up data to be able to continue
functioning? 🙂
–
Susan
Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator
Please read the following before posting in here:
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---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 5, 2016, 7:38pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/44 "2016-11-05T19:38:47Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> But, if the worst happens, and the cloud is down, will you be able to
> do anything with the backed up data to be able to continue
> functioning? :)[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
I get that, but one of the reasons it was decided to go this way was to
free up a bunch of storage space locally, and having a copy of the data
locally will not do that.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 5, 2016, 9:20pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/45 "2016-11-05T21:20:55Z")
OMG, you have the pointy haired boss! 🙂
–
Susan
Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator
Please read the following before posting in here:
[http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy](http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy)
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 5, 2016, 9:27pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/46 "2016-11-05T21:27:11Z")
Stevo:
I got an answer, not from someone who works for Micro Focus, so,
though this is an answer from a very knowledgeable person, it should
not be construed as an “official” answer:
"It depends what licenses they have now. “They may have a
subscription, in which case they won’t be allowed to keep using it.
Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won’t
get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count.”
–
Susan
Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator
Please read the following before posting in here:
[http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy](http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy)
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2016, 4:44pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/47 "2016-11-07T16:44:11Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> "It depends what licenses they have now. “They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won’t be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won’t
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count.”[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
Ok, I’m guessing we bought them, as we’ve had licenses since the GW4.1
days, although didn’t get to our current count until GW5.5 I think.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2016, 4:55pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/48 "2016-11-07T16:55:56Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> "It depends what licenses they have now. “They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won’t be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won’t
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count.”[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
I’m also guessing that if GMS is not allowed, the same thing would
apply to Messenger.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2016, 8:02pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/49 "2016-11-07T20:02:18Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> "It depends what licenses they have now. “They may have a
> subscription, in which case they won’t be allowed to keep using it.
> Or they may have bought them, in that case they can continue to use
> them, but, they are not allowed to continue to use GMS, they won’t
> get new patches, and they may not exceed their license count.”[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
I mentioned this to the people in our office spearheading this project
this morning. Caught them off guard a bit, and they found our license
agreement, and this is the case, so there would be no more GMS or
Messenger. They also realized that we would no longer have access to
SLES (our web server doing reverse proxy stuff) and would have to find
some other way to get this done.
, kinda made me giggle.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@kgroneman](https://forums.suse.com/u/kgroneman)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2016, 10:55pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/50 "2016-11-07T22:55:08Z")
Just stay on GW. Easier for everyone. 🙂
–
Kim - 11/7/2016 1:54:48 PM
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2016, 11:11pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/51 "2016-11-07T23:11:20Z")
kgroneman sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> Just stay on GW. Easier for everyone. :-)[/color]
So my response to kgroneman’s comment is…
Oh believe me, I _WANT_ to, but it’s not up to me. ☹
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 8, 2016, 4:37am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/52 "2016-11-08T04:37:05Z")
LOL The amusing times have already begun. 🙂
–
Susan
Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator
Please read the following before posting in here:
[http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy](http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy)
[color=blue]
> , kinda made me giggle.[/color]
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 8, 2016, 4:41pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/53 "2016-11-08T16:41:44Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> LOL The amusing times have already begun. :)[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
Oh, and then it was found out m$ has not informed them of some things
beforehand, even after dozens of meetings. Something about data upload
limits with sharepoint online, other sharepoint fees, etc etc.
So begins the fleecing methinks.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 9, 2016, 3:04am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/54 "2016-11-09T03:04:43Z")
Things are getting interesting! I’ll bet you smile at everything you
hear like this. 🙂
–
Susan
Micro Focus Community Chat Moderator
Please read the following before posting in here:
[http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy](http://preview.tinyurl.com/27zopdy)
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [November 9, 2016, 4:40pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/55 "2016-11-09T16:40:29Z")
Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> Things are getting interesting! I’ll bet you smile at everything you
> hear like this. :)[/color]
So my response to Susan’s comment is…
I most certainly do.
–
Stevo
---
### Author:  [@AndersG](https://forums.suse.com/u/AndersG)
#### Post date: [December 22, 2016, 4:17pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/56 "2016-12-22T16:17:15Z")
Kgroneman,[color=blue]
> I’m always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> system/company to host critical systems[/color]
Was it not Douglas Adams that wrote about SEP-Fields (Someone Else’s
Problem)
–
Anders Gustafsson (NKP)
The Aaland Islands (N60 E20)
Have an idea for a product enhancement? Please visit:
[https://www.novell.com/products/enhancement-request.html](https://www.novell.com/products/enhancement-request.html)
---
### Author:  [@Jim1](https://forums.suse.com/u/Jim1)
#### Post date: [December 22, 2016, 7:12pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/57 "2016-12-22T19:12:13Z")
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:17:15 +0000, Anders Gustafsson wrote:
[color=blue]
> Kgroneman,[color=green]
>
> > I’m always a little amazed at how people trust some external
> > system/company to host critical systems[/color]
>
> Was it not Douglas Adams that wrote about SEP-Fields (Someone Else’s
> Problem)[/color]
It was indeed. (“Somebody Else’s Problem”, but close enough. 😉 )
Jim
–
Jim Henderson, CNA6, CDE, CNI, LPIC-1, CLA10, CLP10
Novell/SUSE/NetIQ Knowledge Partner
---
### Author:  [@kjhurni](https://forums.suse.com/u/kjhurni)
#### Post date: [December 22, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/58 "2016-12-22T21:06:01Z")
stevo;2445397 Wrote:[color=blue]
> Susan sounds like they ‘said’:
> [color=green]
>
> > Also, wouldn’t there be licensing for the Microsoft Cloud solution?[/color]
>
> So my response to Susan’s comment is…
>
> Yes there would be licensing for that direction. Budget was submitted
> to go one way or the other, all or nothing, and not sure if the number
> would cover staying with what we have and including filr or not.
>
> I emailed our contact at cdw to see about a quote, just to see what it
> runs per license.
>
> It’s a complicated situation here, moving to m$'s ecs licensing would
> probably make things easier licensing-wise, and they’re trying to sell
> my boss saying it will be cheaper in the long run, but I don’t believe
> that’s the case.
>
> –
> Stevo[/color]
Well, be very careful of what MS claims. MS claimed it would save us
millions and it turned out to be the other way around.
O365 (at the G3 level) is licensed per mailbox per month. Our GroupWise
(60k/year) went to 1.2 million for O365. How’s that for a “cost
savings”.
We _used_ to be able to buy Office for $289 for 3 years under the old
licensing model and that was on a per machine license. Another area had
6,000 machines, but 40k, users.
Well when we were forced to “save money” to O365, the other area now has
to pay for 40,000 licenses per month at somewhere around $12/user/month.
So $144/user/year. No cost savings there.
Oh, and the WAN upgrades needed to support the cloud? Yeah, our monthly
bill is about 10x what it used to be.
Oh, and you have to use the nasty MS “on demand” Office install which
means you cannot configure it, you run it and it installs EVERYTHING.
Whether you want/need it or not. And you also get the joy of being
force-upgraded/patched without ANY notification by MS. We’re constantly
having Outlook problems because MS is essentially using the entire o365
stack as beta testers, except you pay for it. For months we had people
not able to access Shared folders, etc.
Now, maybe in a SMALL environment, it would make sense. For a large
place, I say avoid it like the plague.
Oh, and OneDrive is nowhere near as nice/flexible as Filr or practically
anything else. OneDrive requires you to have pre-knowledge about what
you need “offsite”, and/or relocate ALL your data in the cloud. Good
luck dealing with access issues/rights/data security in that
envirioment.
Oh, it’s also problem prone for anything pretty much over 30,000 files
(not unusual for us) or “large” amounts of data. Again, may work in a
smaller environment.
But that’s just me. I’m sure O365 works well for some people without
many problems at all, but I seriously question the methodology that MS
uses to claim a “cost savings”. Seriously do you think that MS would
want everyone over to model that “saves money” (ie, makes them LESS
money)? They don’t like people buying a copy of Office and keeping it
for 5+ years. They want a guaranteed stream of revenue (even Office
personal after the first “intro” year is like $100/year or something).
## – The opinions expressed are my own. Check out my OES2 Guides: Installing OES2 SP2: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11600/oes2-sp2-installation-guide](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11600/oes2-sp2-installation-guide) Upgrading to OES2 with ID Transfer: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11601/oes2-sp2-migration-guide-transfer-id-scenarios](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11601/oes2-sp2-migration-guide-transfer-id-scenarios) GroupWise Migration with OES2 ID Transfer: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11602/groupwise-migration-netware-oes2-sp2-transfer-id](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11602/groupwise-migration-netware-oes2-sp2-transfer-id)
kjhurni’s Profile: [https://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=734](https://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=734)
View this thread: [https://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=501487](https://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=501487)
---
### Author:  [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2016, 12:59am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/cloud-question/28725/59 "2016-12-23T00:59:05Z")
kjhurni sounds like they ‘said’:
[color=blue]
> Well, be very careful of what MS claims. MS claimed it would save us
> millions and it turned out to be the other way around.
>
> O365 (at the G3 level) is licensed per mailbox per month. Our
> GroupWise (60k/year) went to 1.2 million for O365. How’s that for a
> “cost savings”.
>
> We used to be able to buy Office for $289 for 3 years under the old
> licensing model and that was on a per machine license. Another area
> had 6,000 machines, but 40k, users.
>
> Well when we were forced to “save money” to O365, the other area now
> has to pay for 40,000 licenses per month at somewhere around
> $12/user/month. So $144/user/year. No cost savings there.
>
> Oh, and the WAN upgrades needed to support the cloud? Yeah, our
> monthly bill is about 10x what it used to be.
>
> Oh, and you have to use the nasty MS “on demand” Office install which
> means you cannot configure it, you run it and it installs EVERYTHING.
> Whether you want/need it or not. And you also get the joy of being
> force-upgraded/patched without ANY notification by MS. We’re
> constantly having Outlook problems because MS is essentially using
> the entire o365 stack as beta testers, except you pay for it. For
> months we had people not able to access Shared folders, etc.
>
> Now, maybe in a SMALL environment, it would make sense. For a large
> place, I say avoid it like the plague.
>
> Oh, and OneDrive is nowhere near as nice/flexible as Filr or
> practically anything else. OneDrive requires you to have
> pre-knowledge about what you need “offsite”, and/or relocate ALL your
> data in the cloud. Good luck dealing with access issues/rights/data
> security in that envirioment.
>
> Oh, it’s also problem prone for anything pretty much over 30,000 files
> (not unusual for us) or “large” amounts of data. Again, may work in a
> smaller environment.
>
> But that’s just me. I’m sure O365 works well for some people without
> many problems at all, but I seriously question the methodology that MS
> uses to claim a “cost savings”. Seriously do you think that MS would
> want everyone over to model that “saves money” (ie, makes them LESS
> money)? They don’t like people buying a copy of Office and keeping it
> for 5+ years. They want a guaranteed stream of revenue (even Office
> personal after the first “intro” year is like $100/year or something).[/color]
So my response to kjhurni’s comment is…
Oh we’ve already been privvy to what M$ “claims”. They said nothing
about data caps, upload caps, stuff like that in any of the 20-100
meetings our people had discussing this.
I’m afraid many of the things you mentioned will rear their ugly heads
for us, but I’ve decided I’m just going to sit back and laugh whenever
things go haywire, as I was staunchly opposed to this decision from day
one.
Plus, we have been directed to cut our budgets (our big one is
operating, right where this whole thing will fall) and I have a feeling
our budget will do nothing but climb now.
–
Stevo
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