# Long file names **URL:** \ **Category:** Chatting over the Back Fence\ **Created:** [February 12, 2013, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617 "2013-02-12T00:56:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![System1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@System1](https://forums.suse.com/u/System1)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/1 "2013-02-12T00:56:04Z")
Do you have users that name files/folders in sentence format? We have some users that name folder structure(s) like this: last name, first name dd.oo.bbbb [folder] {blah blah} here is a phrase for a folder (more folder name) [sub folder} file name ~ that is actually longer that what I’ve typed here The words are not the same as their actual words in the file/folder names, but the special chars are in there, and their file/folder names are longer than what I typed in here. We’ve talked to people in this dept before about this, but apparently it fell on deaf ears. What have you done in dealing with folder structures like this? Were you able to get the users to cut the names down? If so, HOW!??!! Thanks, – Stevo ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 1:20am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/2 "2013-02-12T01:20:39Z")
Sorry to be annoying but… why does this matter? I hate the names like this, but I do not see why it justifies being looked at other than by the sorry folks who can’t seem to come up with names that make IT people smile. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/3 "2013-02-12T01:22:24Z")
ab sounds like they ‘said’: [color=blue] > Sorry to be annoying but… why does this matter? I hate the names > like this, but I do not see why it justifies being looked at other > than by the sorry folks who can’t seem to come up with names that > make IT people smile. > > Good luck.[/color] So my response to ab’s comment is… We are looking at migrating data to a different server, and some of these are causing problems for data copies. Also, have heard some complaints of people not being able to get back into these files. – Stevo ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 1:39am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/4 "2013-02-12T01:39:04Z")
How about this: Create a cron job which uses the ‘find’ command and deletes anything that you deem to be “evil” in nature. When users complain tell them it’s because more characters make the server work harder and drive up costs so short names are required. If that’s too obvious a lie for end users, try something like the length of the names must be kept in memory and the computer needs to handle all of these at once and it’s too much to remember. As a test, ask them if they can remember the exact name of their directories without looking. What is this software you are using, out of curiosity? Because I’m a sick individual I’ve setup a few multi-hundred-character files/directories and copied them around without issue, so I assume this is some software with less brainpower than the ‘cp’ or ‘mv’ commands. Are the machines hosting the disks that are being moved physical or virtual? Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 1:48am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/5 "2013-02-12T01:48:53Z")
ab sounds like they ‘said’: [color=blue] > How about this: > > Create a cron job which uses the ‘find’ command and deletes anything > that you deem to be “evil” in nature. When users complain tell them > it’s because more characters make the server work harder and drive up > costs so short names are required. If that’s too obvious a lie for > end users, try something like the length of the names must be kept in > memory and the computer needs to handle all of these at once and it’s > too much to remember. As a test, ask them if they can remember the > exact name of their directories without looking. > > What is this software you are using, out of curiosity? Because I’m a > sick individual I’ve setup a few multi-hundred-character > files/directories and copied them around without issue, so I assume > this is some software with less brainpower than the ‘cp’ or ‘mv’ > commands. > > Are the machines hosting the disks that are being moved physical or > virtual? > > Good luck.[/color] So my response to ab’s comment is… I’d like to do something like that, I’m sure my boss would put the kybosh (sp?) on it… Just word processing software, and windows os. When I try to rename one of these real long files (with XP), I get an error: Cannot rename : The filename, directory name, or volume label syntax is incorrect. In windows 7, I don’t even have the option to rename it. Some of these are ms word-macro enabled docs. I’m unable to rename the folder in which this file resides, the user is unable to rename it either. – Stevo ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 5:56pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/6 "2013-02-12T17:56:01Z")
ab;2246031 Wrote:[color=blue] > Sorry to be annoying but… why does this matter? I hate the names > like > this, but I do not see why it justifies being looked at other than by > the > sorry folks who can’t seem to come up with names that make IT people > smile. > > Good luck.[/color] It matters because either there’s a bug in the Novell client or Netware/OES software or a “feature” of MS Windows. You can, apparently, create and WRITE a file well in excess of 255 characters to a NetWare or OES Linux server via NCP just fine. But then you won’t be able to update/modify/delete it. We’ve only ever been able to use the native Linux tools or the Linux NRM view to rename/delete/etc. the file I’d stumbled across some obtuse MS article that was confusing as all heck as to what the “real” limit for file names is/was. It just seemed really odd that you could CREATE something in violation of the limit, but then not be able to modify/save/overwrite/delete it (you CAN open it and look at it though). ## – The opinions expressed are my own. Check out my OES2 Guides: Installing OES2 SP2: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11600/oes2-sp2-installation-guide](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11600/oes2-sp2-installation-guide) Upgrading to OES2 with ID Transfer: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11601/oes2-sp2-migration-guide-transfer-id-scenarios](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11601/oes2-sp2-migration-guide-transfer-id-scenarios) GroupWise Migration with OES2 ID Transfer: [http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11602/groupwise-migration-netware-oes2-sp2-transfer-id](http://www.novell.com/communities/node/11602/groupwise-migration-netware-oes2-sp2-transfer-id) kjhurni’s Profile: [http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=734](http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=734) View this thread: [http://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=464016](http://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=464016) ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 6:30pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/7 "2013-02-12T18:30:40Z")
Stevo wrote: [color=blue] > Do you have users that name files/folders in sentence format?[/color] Yes. And I have users that try to tunnel to the center of the earth with sub directories. Annoying. And yes I’ve had cases where I can’t work with the files. Normally I get calls when someone gets a .pdf attachment from someone who doesn’t understand file lengths or special characters…Hey maybe our users are correpsonding with each other. : ) ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 7:41pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/8 "2013-02-12T19:41:36Z")
GofBorg sounds like they ‘said’: [color=blue] > Yes. And I have users that try to tunnel to the center of the earth > with sub directories. Annoying. And yes I’ve had cases where I can’t > work with the files. Normally I get calls when someone gets a .pdf > attachment from someone who doesn’t understand file lengths or > special characters…Hey maybe our users are correpsonding with each > other. : )[/color] So my response to GofBorg’s comment is… Could be, you never know. Sometimes I get a call about an attachment that did not come through with an email. When I go find said attachment, it’s named something like: attachment 1.date.time.name.of.author.pdf, and of course we’re stripping off attachments with multiple extensions. People I guess don’t understand extensions…sigh – Stevo ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/9 "2013-02-12T20:18:14Z")
kjhurni wrote: [color=blue] > It matters because either there’s a bug in the Novell client or > Netware/OES software or a “feature” of MS Windows. > > You can, apparently, create and WRITE a file well in excess of 255 > characters to a NetWare or OES Linux server via NCP just fine. But > then you won’t be able to update/modify/delete it. > > We’ve only ever been able to use the native Linux tools or the Linux > NRM view to rename/delete/etc. the file[/color] Normally, regardless of the OS that hosts the file, I’ll map a drive as deep in the directory structure as possible to get at the file. [color=blue] > I’d stumbled across some obtuse MS article that was confusing as all > heck as to what the “real” limit for file names is/was.[/color] You mean this one? 🙂 [http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-nz/library/windows/desktop/aa365247(v=vs.85).aspx#maxpath](http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-nz/library/windows/desktop/aa365247%28v=vs.85%29.aspx#maxpath) In short, there is a hard-coded limit in Windows of ~260 characters depending on the function that is called - UNICODE versions of the functions have a different limit. IIRC the maxpath is defined as a #DEFINE in a Windows header, which means it is perfectly reasonable to expect older programs to be hard coded with that value to honour the value rather than what the OS actually returns. I like this little pearl from the link above - which actually makes sense if you think about creating shares “The shell and the file system have different requirements. It is possible to create a path with the Windows API that the shell user interface is not able to interpret properly.” There was a blog or a video that I read/watched within the last year or two where a MS employee was talking about the challenges of changing the limits - they were significant from an application compatibility perspective. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:26pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/10 "2013-02-12T23:26:37Z")
> Sometimes I get a call about an attachment that did not come through[color=blue] > with an email.[/color] %242342wre2%Annual%@report%regarding%something%of%great%importance%-%really%it\_is%^f2n2kjn3nn\_54i5nj5in342. %pdf%.pdf/~^ ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:29pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/11 "2013-02-12T23:29:28Z")
> I like this little pearl from the link above - which actually makes[color=blue] > sense if you think about creating shares > “The shell and the file system have different requirements. It is > possible to create a path with the Windows API that the shell user > interface is not able to interpret properly.”[/color] Especially when the shell interprets: 2013 Income Tax Refund General Stats for Fiscal Year as: 2013\_INC~1 ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:49pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/12 "2013-02-12T23:49:11Z")
GofBorg sounds like they ‘said’: [color=blue] > %242342wre2%Annual%@report%regarding%something%of%great%importance%-%r > eally%it\_is%^f2n2kjn3nn\_54i5nj5in342. %pdf%.pdf/~\[1\] So my response to GofBorg’s comment is… Seriously!?! Holy buckets! – Stevo * * * 1. /color ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 12:06am UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/13 "2013-02-13T00:06:58Z")
> When I go find said attachment, it’s named something like:[color=blue] > > attachment 1.date.time.name.of.author.pdf, and of course we’re > stripping off attachments with multiple extensions. People I guess > don’t understand extensions…sigh[/color] I’m not trying to be contrary, but this is contrary to that statement. The problem with extensions is that people DO understand them, better than most IT folks. Here’s a test: What is in this file: somefile.txt Now windows will helpfully hide that last bit, so you’ll actually just see: somefile IT folks incorrect answer: plain text. Pednatic IT folks: plain text, probably ascii-based, with either newlines only (on \*nix platforms) or carriage-return/newline combinations (for windows) or just carriage returns (for old Mac OS boxes). End user: I dunno. And who is correct? The end user. Extensions don’t mean anything, at all, ever. It is only because some programs act based on this text that happens to be at the end after a dot that we think extensions mean something, but they don’t, and really never should have. IT folks moved away from books and probably forgot what “Don’t judge a book by its cover” means, so they used extensions as covers that meant something even though they are just a cover for whatever happens to be inside. This affects people from a security perspective (probably why e-mails with attachments with multiple extensions are stripped) because that evil extension-hiding feature in windows lets you send crap like this: awesome-pic.jpg.exe and because the last bit is stripped off (asinine, really asinine) it looks like awesome-pic.jpg and then people open it. While stripping these attachments out fixes this specific use case, it does nothing for the real problem: end users running things that they should not. Phishing? Sites with questionable content that they willingly install (“It’s just a screen saver…”)? The problem isn’t extensions, the problem isn’t file names, we like to partition files into buckets based on extensions but they really don’t mean more than any scapegoat does. The problems is understanding what is really in the file (regardless of the extension) and understanding why users are going after it in the first place (or in your case, why they are using really long file names in the first place). The last time I saw a file with a name like that it was because microsoft word didn’t require users to specify a file name that they made up; instead, it took the first line of the document and made that the file name. When the user opted to save it they took that default and voila, long file name. That’s not microsoft’s fault, or word’s fault… it’s the user’s choice and in a vacuum of better ways to name things that’s what they chose. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![kgroneman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f1d935/32.png) [@kgroneman](https://forums.suse.com/u/kgroneman)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 8:04pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/14 "2013-02-13T20:04:22Z")
Good post Aaron. The last .xxx on a file just tells the OS what program to _try_ to open it with, if you’ve configured an association (or stuck with the default associations). Also, the FIRST thing I personally do after I install Winderz is to tell it to display all extensions for known file types and go from there. – Kim - 2/13/2013 11:00:43 AM ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2013, 5:34pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/15 "2013-02-15T17:34:58Z")
> > %242342wre2%Annual%@report%regarding%something%of%great%importance%-%r[color=blue][color=green] > > eally%it\_is%^f2n2kjn3nn\_54i5nj5in342. %pdf%.pdf/~\[1\] > > So my response to GofBorg’s comment is… > > Seriously!?! Holy buckets! > [/color] Yes seriously. I have no idea what system generates these filenames but it’s a piece of work. * * * 1. /color ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/16 "2013-02-15T17:39:33Z")
[color=blue] > somefile > > IT folks incorrect answer: plain text.[/color] Not sure where you get your IT folks. My first thought was ‘unknown’. Even when I see a file named something like file.xls, I don’t assume it’s an excel file. Why? End (l)users are notorious for naming files incorrectly. If an ‘excel’ file won’t open for a user, I open it in a text editor to ferret out whether or not it actually is an excel file. Usually it’s a word doc. Blanket statements like ‘IT doesn’t get it’ are incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2013, 5:41pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/17 "2013-02-15T17:41:49Z")
GofBorg sounds like they ‘said’: [color=blue] > Yes seriously. I have no idea what system generates these filenames > but it’s a piece of work.[/color] So my response to GofBorg’s comment is… No kidding. Sounds like some sleuthing is in order. – Stevo ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/uploads/suse/original/2X/5/5012ba89e3ffb5220dac47d5ea0ba032e2fe1cb6.png) [@system](https://forums.suse.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2013, 5:44pm UTC](https://forums.suse.com/t/long-file-names/23617/18 "2013-02-15T17:44:56Z")
> Blanket statements like ‘IT doesn’t get it’ are incorrect. Good thing I didn’t write that, then. Good luck.